Re: Fulcanelli path

[Galeidoscope]

"In his Dwellings of the philosophers Fulcanelli openly rejected Stibnite as being the true materia prima... "

Actually, he rejects antimony, not stibnite. I think that was a false blind. Antimony is not the material, stibnite is.
And you know when they speak openly they conceal.

No this is not correct. Fulcanelli specified: "as for the MINERAL Stibnite if posess none of the required qualities and in whatever manner we want to treat it neither the secret solvent or the philosophical mercury could be made from it."

You may also consult the adept who examined antimony and mineral Stibnite more than any one else viz. Basil Valentine and he did, as you may read in one of my former quotes in this thread, not consider neither Stibnite nor antimony as being the true matter for making the philosophers stone. You may also meditate over the fact that why it should be a great secret to envolve a starrypattern from Stibnite? This is a chemical triviality and does not envolve any alchemical parameters at all. However, if you could accomplish the same upon the surface of lead and have it friable (without the help of any additional matters forming an alloy) it would be most curious to say the least... Because this can only be accomplish by the natural and secret fire which is the secret of secrets.

GALEIDOSCOPE

[solomon levi]

Thanks for the education, G.

So the difference then, is that S makes a firestone but not a Red Lion?
S can't be taken all the way?

Still hard to believe, the way it swallows metals and stuff, that it's not the prima materia.

[Galeidoscope]

Yes that is a correct interpretation Solomon Levi: fire stone (a particular) is indeed possible by antimony / S but not the red lion which according to BV is found in another mineral which he describes as the astrum solis...

However all this is in accordace to the Basil Valentine and Fulcanelli paradigm, of course one must not necessarely limit the study to them (I dare to say I have been through, studied, more than a couple of hundred different texts in english and french), there are certainly other (and completely different) paths to follow too, if they all lead to Rome is up to you judgement dear aspiring adepts.

GALEIDOSCOPE

[Pink Panther]

Hi,

I'm also pleased to read your discussion.

Galeidoscope,
I suppose you also think about Van Dongen's frontispice of Irene Hillel-Erlanger's novel, don't you ?

We know from the correspondence between Gifreda and Canseliet, that the latter from the beginning worked on G

you mean you read that correspondence ?


I would like to come back to your initial question : have you managed to realize a lead regulus stellated and friable ?
I haven't had the opportunity to work on lead yet, but sooner or later I'd be pleased to do so, in the way to compare metallic sulphides behaviours. Whatever, I heard about people who succeeded in obtaining a stellated lead regulus... friable I don't know. With S, friable is possible.

G, S, or M as you wish : you point a primordial key. Shifting the crystallization of a metal or a mineral, without making an alloy. The initial purpose is, according to me, to modify the structure of the material without addition of material. Transfering in the ore the soul, the memory of the iron, while rejecting the body of the iron.
If we forget texts, do your experimental results show you that G is better than S for this operation ?

Glad to read you
PP

[Illen A. Cluf]

All the cabala which is usefull in Alchemy is explained in "Clef des oeuvres de saint jean et de michel de nostredame" by M.A. de Nantes.
All the Greek Myths are explained with alchemy by using etymology, signification of greek terms etc.
This is the must..

Green Lion, do you know whether this book by M.A. de Nantes has been translated into English? If not, is there an electronic version of this book availalble?

Thank you.

[Green Lion]

Hi Illen A. Cluf

No, unfortunately, there is no translation of the MA de Nantes book .
It has never been digitized either.
As against, it is sometimes available for sale in its French version.

[Illen A. Cluf]

No, unfortunately, there is no translation of the MA de Nantes book .
It has never been digitized either.
As against, it is sometimes available for sale in its French version.

Hello Green Lion,

Thank you for your response. That is disapointing that there is no translation. I have searched for de Nante's book, but have not been able to find a used copy that is reasonably priced. However, you did say that you thought that Fulcanelli's books were much better in defining the bird language than de Nante's book, so that is encouraging. I have been attemping to create my own glossary of the terms he uses in his books for some time, but it's still a long way from completion.

Are you aware of any other attmpts to create such lists? I'm surprised that there seems to be so little effort in that regard.

Illen

[Green Lion]

There are others who have done this kind of list.
But each time, these lists were "tinted" with regard to the election matter of the authors.
For example Roger Caro has done, but it only works for the cinnabar path.

The best thing is to make oneself such list. It is more profitable.

[Illen A. Cluf]

There are others who have done this kind of list.
But each time, these lists were "tinted" with regard to the election matter of the authors.
For example Roger Caro has done, but it only works for the cinnabar path.

The best thing is to make oneself such list. It is more profitable.

Thanks for your reply, Green Lion. I think the list is worth completing in any regard, since much more is learned and comprehended in the process of making the list itself.

[pierre]

Hello friends, I was reading your posts and saw references to the letter G that you associated with the galene instead stibnite of the dry path of Fulcanelli.

Recalling Fulcanelli phrases as "...not proper mineral and even less metalic” , and that the letter G is represented, Fulcanelli said, amid a radiant star, and is called Saturnian Antimony...

Don`t you have thought about graphite? Graphite is a black substance, greasy and stained fingers; it is not mineral or metal; formerly it was called Plombagina, because people believed it contained lead in their substance.

The graphite is obtained from the carbono dissolved in the molten iron, and when cooled, graphite occurs in the form of needles. (¿star?)

Is also an excellent electrical conductor.

Is just an alternative to the idea that you discussed.

[solomon levi]

I have also given some thought to Graphite.
Carbon - carbuncle
Coal - Al kohl/alcohol = antimony.

Fulcanelli also said the materia was signed by nature with a sigma/six.
Carbon is the 6th element - 6 protons, 6 neutrons, 6 electrons - 666.

[Illen A. Cluf]

Don`t you have thought about graphite? Graphite is a black substance, greasy and stained fingers; it is not mineral or metal; formerly it was called Plombagina, because people believed it contained lead in their substance.

The graphite is obtained from the carbono dissolved in the molten iron, and when cooled, graphite occurs in the form of needles. (¿star?)

Interesting possibility. In the past, graphite was also thought to be a black lead and was called "black lead" or "plumbago". And it is a semi-metal. However, the substance was described as having "scales" rather than needles. Are there any treatises that mention graphite as a possibility?

Illen

[pierre]

I have also given some thought to Graphite.
Carbon - carbuncle
Coal - Al kohl/alcohol = antimony.

Fulcanelli also said the materia was signed by nature with a sigma/six.
Carbon is the 6th element - 6 protons, 6 neutrons, 6 electrons - 666.

This devil image of the coarseness material, as opposed to spirituality, is the first jeroglific to the mineral substance ...

It saw in another time under the figure of SATAN ...

Black and covered with scales ...
...and of strong sickening smell ...
...that stain your fingers when you touch it ... (Fulcanelli)

By other hand, I think from alcohol to antimony, there is a big phonetic difference ... ¿Don`t you think so?

[pierre]

Don`t you have thought about graphite? Graphite is a black substance, greasy and stained fingers; it is not mineral or metal; formerly it was called Plombagina, because people believed it contained lead in their substance.

The graphite is obtained from the carbono dissolved in the molten iron, and when cooled, graphite occurs in the form of needles. (¿star?)

Interesting possibility. In the past, graphite was also thought to be a black lead and was called "black lead" or "plumbago". And it is a semi-metal. However, the substance was described as having "scales" rather than needles. Are there any treatises that mention graphite as a possibility?
Illen

Are there any treatises that mention graphite as a possibility?

I do not know any.

However, the substance was described as having "scales" rather than needles

Yes;
Needles were a reference to the starry regulus, not the raw matter ...; but you are correct in your appreciation.
I'm just "thinking out loud".

[Illen A. Cluf]

Hi Pierre,

[quote="pierreHowever, the substance was described as having "scales" rather than needles

Yes;
Needles were a reference to the starry regulus, not the raw matter ...; but you are correct in your appreciation.
I'm just "thinking out loud".[/quote]

I actually enjoy "out of the box" thinking, and your suggestion certainly has merit. Fulcanelli did mention that the matter stains the hand, and is black, so both lead and graphite fit this description, although lead does not start with "g". However, regarding the substance that starts with the letter "G", Fulcanelli also suggests that the word has its roots in the word "gall" (e.g. the gall of an oak tree) and "Gaul" as in "France". This immediately brings to mind "galena", but I'm surprised that hardly anyone ever also mentions the possibility that it could also be the element "gallium" which begins with "GalL".

Just a little more food for thought.

Illen

[horticult]

I am afraid that graphite is common max 100 years now. But I was hinted on orpiment - sun signed, with scales!, Timaos - knot of gold, it smells, its sign and Fulcanelli and that safety pin... Certainly remarkable.
And if then that black is a lie.

[solomon levi]

Illen,
Graphite is simply carbon, so we can consider the manifestations of coal,
charcoal, soot, and diamond, as well as graphite. Then there may be some
connection to potassium carbonate as ash.

Carbon also makes sense as a first matter, since every living thing is carbon-based
on this planet.

I think I mentioned somewhere that ammonium carbonate is the simplest
matter that covers all four elements:

NH4CO3
Nitrogen - air
Hydrogen - fire
Oxygen - water
Carbon - earth

(is hydrogen fire or water? Fire consumes oxygen, so I guess it can't BE oxygen.
But when we talk about getting water we say "hydration". Hmmm?)

There is much talk about ammonium being the secret fire, so it deserves consideration.
Ammonium carbonate was called Salt of Hartshorn.

[BeautifulEvil]

Carbon can do some pretty interesting things. I know the "soot" that rises with fire has been known to contain buckyballs. It could be considered a "volatile" or "sublimed" form of carbon.

There is much talk about ammonium being the secret fire, so it deserves consideration.
Ammonium carbonate was called Salt of Hartshorn.

I've heard multiple things. Some say the secret fire is an ammonium salt, but others mention that the secret fire accompanies ammonium salts (they act as magnets). I'm not too sure what I believe, but I am of the notion that ammonium salts may be acting as magnets of the secret fire. Could be totally wrong though!

[solomon levi]

By other hand, I think from alcohol to antimony, there is a big phonetic difference ... ¿Don`t you think so?

Yes, but if the name "antimony" signifies the first matter, then the name
is phoenetic to coal, for the old ones called it "al kohl", which somehow
later became alcohol.

[solomon levi]

Carbon can do some pretty interesting things. I know the "soot" that rises with fire has been known to contain buckyballs. It could be considered a "volatile" or "sublimed" form of carbon.

There is much talk about ammonium being the secret fire, so it deserves consideration.
Ammonium carbonate was called Salt of Hartshorn.

I've heard multiple things. Some say the secret fire is an ammonium salt, but others mention that the secret fire accompanies ammonium salts (they act as magnets). I'm not too sure what I believe, but I am of the notion that ammonium salts may be acting as magnets of the secret fire. Could be totally wrong though!

But if lightning puts ammonia in the air and makes for better
rain water, then that's something other than a salt magnet. That is,
it supports the idea that the ammonia is secret fire and not magnet.

[pierre]

By other hand, I think from alcohol to antimony, there is a big phonetic difference ... ¿Don`t you think so?

Yes, but if the name "antimony" signifies the first matter, then the name
is phoenetic to coal, for the old ones called it "al kohl", which somehow
later became alcohol.

Hi solomon.
I agree with you that alcohol is used as a philosophical subject by some authors.

[pierre]

Carbon can do some pretty interesting things. I know the "soot" that rises with fire has been known to contain buckyballs. It could be considered a "volatile" or "sublimed" form of carbon.

There is much talk about ammonium being the secret fire, so it deserves consideration.
Ammonium carbonate was called Salt of Hartshorn.

I've heard multiple things. Some say the secret fire is an ammonium salt, but others mention that the secret fire accompanies ammonium salts (they act as magnets). I'm not too sure what I believe, but I am of the notion that ammonium salts may be acting as magnets of the secret fire. Could be totally wrong though!

But if lightning puts ammonia in the air and makes for better
rain water, then that's something other than a salt magnet. That is,
it supports the idea that the ammonia is secret fire and not magnet.

Hi, BE And solomon.
Many people think that dew containing a salt that has remarkable properties solvents. This very volatile salt of ammonium is NH4NO2. This salt should be distilled from dew to a very mild temperature, (60 º C maximum) because it oxidizes and becomes easily NH4NO3, and in this state is completely useless.

[BeautifulEvil]

Hi, BE And solomon.
Many people think that dew containing a salt that has remarkable properties solvents. This very volatile salt of ammonium is NH4NO2. This salt should be distilled from dew to a very mild temperature, (60 º C maximum) because it oxidizes and becomes easily NH4NO3, and in this state is completely useless.

I've heard of this before, but I can't recall where. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.

Ammonium nitrite can be made by oxidizing ammonia with ozone. Ozone can be produced via high voltage corona discharge. In my opinion, this would yield a very interesting "philosophical' product (on account of the electricity).

[Illen A. Cluf]

Illen,
Graphite is simply carbon, so we can consider the manifestations of coal,
charcoal, soot, and diamond, as well as graphite. Then there may be some
connection to potassium carbonate as ash.

Carbon also makes sense as a first matter, since every living thing is carbon-based
on this planet.

I think I mentioned somewhere that ammonium carbonate is the simplest
matter that covers all four elements:

NH4CO3
Nitrogen - air
Hydrogen - fire
Oxygen - water
Carbon - earth

(is hydrogen fire or water? Fire consumes oxygen, so I guess it can't BE oxygen.
But when we talk about getting water we say "hydration". Hmmm?)

There is much talk about ammonium being the secret fire, so it deserves consideration.
Ammonium carbonate was called Salt of Hartshorn.

Hi Solomon,

Carbon is certainly a good candidate for further research. It's black, brittle, comes in layers like a closed book, marks the hands, and can come in 6-sided plates like the scales of a dragon (graphite). Fulcanelli states that the subject matter is associated with the number "6". Carbon is the sixth element and it also comes in 6-sided scales as mentioned above. It is also not either a metal or a true mineral.

Regarding ammonium carbonate, hydrogen is an important component of water, as is oxygen, but as separated from water, it is difficult to categorize where they should be included. The message seems to be that elements individually are different than their compounds, so the true test of whether a compound contains the four elelents is likley its overall properties

Illen.

[pierre]

Hi, BE And solomon.
Many people think that dew containing a salt that has remarkable properties solvents. This very volatile salt of ammonium is NH4NO2. This salt should be distilled from dew to a very mild temperature, (60 º C maximum) because it oxidizes and becomes easily NH4NO3, and in this state is completely useless.

I've heard of this before, but I can't recall where. Thanks for bringing it back to my attention.

Ammonium nitrite can be made by oxidizing ammonia with ozone. Ozone can be produced via high voltage corona discharge. In my opinion, this would yield a very interesting "philosophical' product (on account of the electricity).

BE, You only need collect and distill the dew gently, and the final resulting salt is ammonium nitrite. In the caput mortum is the nitrite, which is extracted by leaching and calcination of this caput mortum.

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