pH swings with Wet Method.
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pH swings with Wet Method.
As a newbie making my own manna using the Wet Method I know my process has greatly improved during the course of only 12 batches. I would like to further advance it and have heard mention "pH swings".
I've seen where one experienced alchemist makes his pH swings from 14 to 1 many times.
For the experienced and learned alchemists out there I was wondering two things.
1. How does a pH swing improve the manna?
2. Rather than taking the pH from 14 to 1 many times, what about just doing a small swing from say 8 to about 5.5 many times? If the purpose is to take the m-state from liquid to solid and back and forth, wouldn't this narrow pH range accomplish this for the many elements that precipitate between 6 and 8?
Thanks in advance All,
Tony
I've seen where one experienced alchemist makes his pH swings from 14 to 1 many times.
For the experienced and learned alchemists out there I was wondering two things.
1. How does a pH swing improve the manna?
2. Rather than taking the pH from 14 to 1 many times, what about just doing a small swing from say 8 to about 5.5 many times? If the purpose is to take the m-state from liquid to solid and back and forth, wouldn't this narrow pH range accomplish this for the many elements that precipitate between 6 and 8?
Thanks in advance All,
Tony
Tony D.- Visita
- Number of posts : 13
Age : 72
Registration date : 2008-09-18
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
I suppose you're talking about m-state gold when using the term "manna."
I think it's best to isolate the m-state, try to remove most of the insoluble magnesium/calcium hydroxides, and then give the remaining powder a decent calcination in an inert (helium) atmosphere. This stuff is said to be very energetic, much more than "normal" m-state.
I think it breaks apart the larger molecules into smaller molecules. I've only heard of this being done to produce a well graduated gold chloride or gold hydroxide. So honestly, I'm not sure how it would work with manna or m-state materials.1. How does a pH swing improve the manna?
I believe the full pH swing is best. Like I said previously, this is how it's done to make a well graduated gold chloride/hydroxide. The color will change over time to a clear solution if done right I believe. You can produce all the colors of the rainbow with pH swings using gold. This is caused by the varied molecule size refracting the light. However, I must say I don't know how this will work with m-states.2. Rather than taking the pH from 14 to 1 many times, what about just doing a small swing from say 8 to about 5.5 many times? If the purpose is to take the m-state from liquid to solid and back and forth, wouldn't this narrow pH range accomplish this for the many elements that precipitate between 6 and 8?
I think it's best to isolate the m-state, try to remove most of the insoluble magnesium/calcium hydroxides, and then give the remaining powder a decent calcination in an inert (helium) atmosphere. This stuff is said to be very energetic, much more than "normal" m-state.
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
Yes, the many swings are for breaking down metals into smaller clusters of atoms.
In a CRC chemistry book, it will tell you that gold chloride is yellowish whereas gold trichloride is reddish.
The different colors show refraction of different sizes. I've heard gold hydroxide is purplish.
As you swing past neutral, these colors will disappear and then reappear as you approach basic pH of 10.5
and acidic pH.
So a smaller swing won't break it down as much.
If you have exctracted m-state from salt waters, there's no need to break it down any further.
You can't get smaller than m-state if that is what you have. That seems to be the question -
is it truly mono-atomic?
Ideally, you don't want gold chloride or nitrate or hydroxide.
This involves a lengthy process of dissolving the gold in acids and washing and evaporating over and over
like David Hudson shows in his patent. But, once again, that's for metallic gold.
For salt waters, we want to eliminate the magnesium, which we can do by manipulating the pH.
The hydrogen can be annealed off at high temperatures as Beautiful Evil mentioned.
In a CRC chemistry book, it will tell you that gold chloride is yellowish whereas gold trichloride is reddish.
The different colors show refraction of different sizes. I've heard gold hydroxide is purplish.
As you swing past neutral, these colors will disappear and then reappear as you approach basic pH of 10.5
and acidic pH.
So a smaller swing won't break it down as much.
If you have exctracted m-state from salt waters, there's no need to break it down any further.
You can't get smaller than m-state if that is what you have. That seems to be the question -
is it truly mono-atomic?
Ideally, you don't want gold chloride or nitrate or hydroxide.
This involves a lengthy process of dissolving the gold in acids and washing and evaporating over and over
like David Hudson shows in his patent. But, once again, that's for metallic gold.
For salt waters, we want to eliminate the magnesium, which we can do by manipulating the pH.
The hydrogen can be annealed off at high temperatures as Beautiful Evil mentioned.
solomon levi- Rectificando
- Number of posts : 262
Registration date : 2008-07-20
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
Thanks for info:)
"I think it's best to isolate the m-state, try to remove most of the insoluble magnesium/calcium hydroxides, and then give the remaining powder a decent calcination in an inert (helium) atmosphere. This stuff is said to be very energetic, much more than "normal" m-state."
My end product is a liquid and not a powder. Right now I don't have the lab equipment to create an inert atmosphere or helium for that matter to calcinate with. I'm not up to that level yet but working on it.
So far what I've done is replaced the initial distilled water with still mineral water and always include Bokek Dead Sea Salt with other salts. This makes a potent catalyst and has increased my precipitate volume. I'm going to split my next batch of "raw" precipitate in two. I'll wash one in distilled and the other in mineral water to see if there's a difference. I also took your advise Sol and only drop to about 9. I also decided to only wash once after precipitation and once after HCL drop using 1:1 precip. to water ratio to keep the manna salty which is supposed "hold" the m-state better.
In time I will move beyond the basic Wet Method after I master it and my intuition and skill increases.
"I think it's best to isolate the m-state, try to remove most of the insoluble magnesium/calcium hydroxides, and then give the remaining powder a decent calcination in an inert (helium) atmosphere. This stuff is said to be very energetic, much more than "normal" m-state."
My end product is a liquid and not a powder. Right now I don't have the lab equipment to create an inert atmosphere or helium for that matter to calcinate with. I'm not up to that level yet but working on it.
So far what I've done is replaced the initial distilled water with still mineral water and always include Bokek Dead Sea Salt with other salts. This makes a potent catalyst and has increased my precipitate volume. I'm going to split my next batch of "raw" precipitate in two. I'll wash one in distilled and the other in mineral water to see if there's a difference. I also took your advise Sol and only drop to about 9. I also decided to only wash once after precipitation and once after HCL drop using 1:1 precip. to water ratio to keep the manna salty which is supposed "hold" the m-state better.
In time I will move beyond the basic Wet Method after I master it and my intuition and skill increases.
Tony D.- Visita
- Number of posts : 13
Age : 72
Registration date : 2008-09-18
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
I understand. It's not too difficult to do this though. Actually, I have a simple method of using an iron pipe with an inlet and outlet. Pump a slow but steady stream of helium into it, hang this over a light coal fire and regulate the temperature carefully (IR temp meter). Do this for a few hours, and in no time you'll have very high quality m-state (if you performed the initial magnesium/calcium separation).My end product is a liquid and not a powder. Right now I don't have the lab equipment to create an inert atmosphere or helium for that matter to calcinate with. I'm not up to that level yet but working on it.
Yeah, that's what I've heard too. The salt water protects the m-state from being zapped by x-rays. You also leave a lot of the magnesium goodies, which are also very healthy.I also decided to only wash once after precipitation and once after HCL drop using 1:1 precip. to water ratio to keep the manna salty which is supposed "hold" the m-state better.
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
You can pour your liquid through a couple coffee filters and get a wet paste,
which then dry in an oven on low (the whole coffee filter with m-state) for a brief time
(don't let the filter catch fire) and then dry the rest of the way just leaving it in a dark place for a couple days.
Then powder it with mortar and pestle. This powder can then be annealed.
which then dry in an oven on low (the whole coffee filter with m-state) for a brief time
(don't let the filter catch fire) and then dry the rest of the way just leaving it in a dark place for a couple days.
Then powder it with mortar and pestle. This powder can then be annealed.
solomon levi- Rectificando
- Number of posts : 262
Registration date : 2008-07-20
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
I'm willing to bet you'll be losing some m-state if you do this. I would just evaporate the remaining liquid+precipitate (after it's been washed a time or two) to obtain the powder. I think It's really useless to do this before you remove the magnesium/calcium hydroxide impurities - only after they've been (mostly) removed.You can pour your liquid through a couple coffee filters and get a wet paste ...
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
Yeah. I forgot to mention, I save the water for consumption.
solomon levi- Rectificando
- Number of posts : 262
Registration date : 2008-07-20
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
I did a little research on gold compounds:
gold chloride is yellow
gold trichloride is claret red
gold trihydroxide is brown
di-gold trioxide is red or brown
tetra-gold octachloride is black
purple of cassius is known to be a gold hydroxide
gold chloride is yellow
gold trichloride is claret red
gold trihydroxide is brown
di-gold trioxide is red or brown
tetra-gold octachloride is black
purple of cassius is known to be a gold hydroxide
solomon levi- Rectificando
- Number of posts : 262
Registration date : 2008-07-20
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
Gold hydroxide can be white (sometimes).
I think 'purple of cassius' is colloidal gold.
'purple of cassius' is known to be a gold hydroxide
I think 'purple of cassius' is colloidal gold.
k89- Visita
- Number of posts : 31
Age : 35
Registration date : 2008-06-28
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
Thanks to All for the suggestions and input :>)
Tony D.- Visita
- Number of posts : 13
Age : 72
Registration date : 2008-09-18
Re: pH swings with Wet Method.
I've read of two gold hydroxides now.
the hydroxide is said to be deep blue, the trihydroxide is said to be brown.
I'm getting this from CRC chemistry handbooks and such.
the hydroxide is said to be deep blue, the trihydroxide is said to be brown.
I'm getting this from CRC chemistry handbooks and such.
solomon levi- Rectificando
- Number of posts : 262
Registration date : 2008-07-20
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